SHORT: I need a vehicle of some sort to haul firewood out of my woodlot... other than my truck because I need 4wd, and the smaller, the better. My Nissan Titan is 2wd and is really too large for trails. LONG: I have a 50-acre woodlot. By manual labor (machete, chainsaw, brushcutter/clearing saw), I have built and maintained trails all around its borders and a couple (so far) within. IMO, it's sort of a rarity in these parts in that it's hardwoods and I have some nice trees, including a number of oaks that are biguns. I want more biguns, I like trees. This is pine plantation country... most tracts have been converted to southern pine. My tract was cut for the pines about 35 years ago and I do have some still but 98% hardwood. So, I plan on doing 'crop tree release' for these biguns and other desirables, such as totally straight white oaks, red oaks, hickory and any and all dogwoods due to their springtime beauty and some other trees that are 'special' just because I only have one or a few of whatever it is. Diversity is good! Crop tree release means I will fell anything that is interfering with the crop tree's growth and long-term health. Which means I have to fell a lot of trees. This is likely a rest-of-my-life project at my age of 70. Ok, so pretty much all hardwoods except sweetgum are good firewood. The sweetgum, I haven't figured out what I can do with, probably nothing. If I did nothing but fell sweetgums over this 50-acres, it might take the rest of my life, lol. Including some monsters. The most common trees I will fell are gums (sweetgum and black gum), red oak, white oak, hickory, red maple, ironwood. Any otherwise desirable tree such as the oaks or hickory, they have to go for the crop tree release if they are in the crop tree's shadow. I hate to just fell them and have them feed the forest floor; I'd feel better about it if I 'do' something with them. Firewood. Could even do some chainsaw milling. The slash will be enough to feed the forest. Getting logs or rounds out of the woods, need something 4wd and small. My 50-hp tractor, I feel is too big for my liking. Have looked at other tractors and machines but still investigating that. I also have a 4wd John Deere Gator and that works but its bed is pretty small. Also have a Honda Foreman 500 ATV. I have looked into getting an ATV trailer. That could work. Although, I don't think a Gator or ATV with trailer would be as maneuverable as a small truck. Or more ideal UTV. I have also looked at lots of UTVs, side by sides, like my Gator. I have found a couple that have larger beds. For that, we're talking serious coin. So, my idea has been that if I elect not to buy an expensive UTV, I could outfox the consumerism demons and buy an old, very small 4wd truck. Like, when I was a young man, Chevy had the LUV truck. There were also Subaru 4wd and then Datsun and Nissan and Toyota. Ford Ranger. I am sure there are a number of old, small trucks that are 4wd. There is also a vehicle made by Mitsubishi, the Minicab, and it's 4wd and has fold-down sides. A benefit of an old 4wd vehicle is it'd be street legal. I don't have to have that but it would be better. I could use it totally on the woodlot but hitting the highway some would be good and it's 5 miles to my house. Just wondering if this fun exercise interests anyone and if you have any thoughts on this. As a for instance, today, I found an old Nissan 4wd in great shape, 'only' 123k miles, for $6,500. (Wish it weren't 5 hours away!) And a Mitsubishi Minicab for $4,500. I have been looking, hoping to find something, say, $7k or less. Heck, I paid $6,700 for my old 2009 Gator! Of course, a Gator works but a small pickup will hold WAY more than a Gator. The downside of a truck is its turning radius. But I have been widening and curve-lessening my trails.
Have you looked into te various used mini trucks. these are smaller than the Chevy Luv or maybe apx same. available in 4wd and many bed options as well ac if really needed . these are not road legal in the states. Considering the prices i have seen on utv these are cheaper . you see them running all over, over seas in Asia . India Africa. made by the big mfgs.
Yep, I mentioned the Mitsubishi Minicab. And there are others, like Honda and Suzuki. To me, these make the most sense in the size department; their wheelbase is much less than a truck. Also have a nice size bed. I have found several for sale within a 4-hr drive for $5k to $8k. I even found one that has a dump bed, now, that would be the ultimate for firewood. The sides fold down on many of them and that would be handy loading firewood.
Just to clarify. You have 5 miles of highway to drive for all these options? Thought I had read one of our members sells gum logs to a mill that makes railroad ties. That might be a nice way to get rid of them. I use an atv with a log arch for my property but highways,,,,that’s out. Half a mile down the blacktop road to a mill is the farthest I’ve driven it
The woodlot is 5 miles from my house on blacktop busy highway. Whatever I would buy, more than likely, it would be kept at the woodlot. But if it's street legal, if I wanted to take some wood to my house, I could. I have a wood splitter at my house but if I have been thinking it would be good to have the/a splitter at the woodlot. The benefit of having a splitter at my house is I can split anytime I feel like it. It could be that another splitter to keep out there would be best. Just this morning, as I unloaded a load of wood at the woodlot from the Gator to my truck, to carry to my house, I thought to myself that if I had a splitter at the woodlot, loading the truck and unloading it would not be necessary. Unload firewood from Gator (or whatever vehicle) to the splitter out there. Less handling is always good! And then again, I've also thought about taking the splitter down my trails to the tree in the woodlot! But that would only be efficient if it's a decent size tree or trees.
I can't figure out how to make it work without a serious investment in equipment. I'd have to, essentially, log the woods of sweetgum, which means get them out of the woods once felled, stack them over a period of days or weeks (if they don't ruin... I don't know) at an accessible landing area until I have a load and then load them onto something, somehow, and haul them to a mill. At this time, I don't have the something or the somehow. (Large trailer and a loader to handle logs.) I could buy a grapple for the tractor but then would need a large trailer. Which is doable. But then we come back to how much are they worth? Several years ago, I was told a landowner would get about $25 for a 16" DBH sweetgum. (I don't know if that also was apropos for a tie log.) But it's not a lot when you have to poor-boy the trees down and get 'em out and to the mill. I have not found a way to make this dollar up. We have a bazillion sweetgum trees around here. They make pallets and ties out of them and also there is hardwood pulp. Sweetgum used to have very little value here but at least they now have some. A 'problem' in forestry these days is that there are almost no little operators anymore, it's all big logging operations. Even a classmate of mine in my little town, his equipment cost quite a few million. And he's one of only a few left here. Used to be lots of people here into logging. Alternatives are to leave them as is or girdle them or fell them to decompose. Leaving them as is defeats crop tree release.
A dumping ATV trailer, like this? They make some that use a 12v winch to dump too... Oh, here is the company I was thinking of...pretty close to walt I think too. ATV Trailers | Off-road Trailers, Carts and Wagons - Made in The USA by Country ATV. ATV Trailers Tandem Axle for Firewood and off road use by Country ATV Products. Chainsaw mill on site?
As for the gum I think you need to find out if there’s a market close enough and what size, length logs they’re looking for. I doubt you’ll get rich off gum logs but maybe it’s worth your while to get them off the property instead of having them lay around rotting. Maybe someone could truck them off for you? Even less money in your pocket. Here’s my toys. They are toys not moneymakers but there’s not a ton of cash invested. The arch is great for taking logs off my property. Not so good cruising down the highway. The trailer is great for grabbing and moving logs from public areas. Mines only 10 but 12 foot is a good size for firewood. 16” 18” both divide equally in 12 feet. A mini truck will move small amounts of firewood but you won’t move logs. An arch to bring them out and transfer to trailer once you have a load? Extra work but,,,,, Same as you I like the log movers because I can work on them home at my leisure. just some ideas to peruse.
Have you looked at the atv log arches. Could drag whole logs out and then process when and where you choose. Just curious but do you have security at the woodlot to keep your equipment from being damaged or walking away? Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Some good ideas posted and pics of cool equipment. As for security out there, I do not have power there. There is a powerline crossing my tract but dropping a utility pole is expensive no matter how close is my understanding. It has concerned me about keeping what I have out there, and more so, if I were to add. Been pondering building a shed for one thing to lock some stuff up. I always carry everything out except I often leave a Gator or ATV and an old trailer hidden in the woods. The good news is trespassing isn't a problem far as I know. Maybe it helps just a little that a deputy sheriff has the adjoining tract, lives out there, and is very active around his property. Somebody mentioned having a logger pick up a load of logs. I checked with some foresters and they said nobody would do it, they just won't fool with it these days. My only hope there is I have a good friend who has a log truck; I have intended to ask him about this. If he won't do it, nobody would. Everything is a challenge. For instance, nobody around here has a truck with a loader on it; those trucks pretty much don't exist here anymore. You'd have to have not only the truck, but a way to load it. My thoughts of late have been that, if nothing else, process whatever trees I thin out as firewood. It bugs me to think of money trees being thinned to just rot. Even the ironwood, I have countless ones big as your arm or leg. I will cut them in rounds for firewood. I also keep the super straight ones as poles; I haven't yet figured out what to do with them. Fencepost? Another problem is heat. Very soon it will be too hot (for me) to work. Until about November, lol. It's really a winter thing, just too dang hot and getting worse.
How large of trees you going to be dealing with? If you are cutting a lot as the post implied, you're gonna get real tired of chucking rounds into a pickup bed, especially if they have any size to them. As far as skidding goes, if you don't have sufficient trail system, you're going to tear up a bunch of residual trees trying to drag out the 'junk'. If you cut them short to skid, you double or triple the amount of trips needed. If most of it is going to be made into splits, I think on site processing might be best. If you are going to pull them, that tractor is going to be your best option. Carve out a landing/yard somewhere and get a 3 point winch for the tractor. They all have 150'+ of line in them, meaning you don't need to drive to every stump to get the trees. I think $5k will buy a nice one...have not looked for a bit.
We have a 1946 CJ-2A that we run on our 153 acre property. It was cheap, easy to work on, and my wife grew up with a WWII Jeep family and spent a lot of time trail riding them in northern Maine. It’s narrow, short wheel base, and light, which makes it pretty easy to drive in the woods. It has a PTO winch on the front that’s really helpful, and saves me sometimes from bringing out the skidding winch on the tractor. We have a cord wood trailer for it, and a firewood trailer, granted it’s not hauling a lot of wood each trip, but that’s the trade off for light and maneuverable. I can cut 4’ logs and load them on the trailer, my wife will drive it back to the yard and unload the trailer with the tractor and grapple, or mini ex. I’ll stay in the woods and keep cutting, since she really enjoys driving the jeep I hardly get a chance to drive it. We also use it to shuttle fuel to the mini ex when it’s way out in the woods working on trails. We looked at UTV’s, mini trucks, and some military surplus big trucks, costs and size played into our decision to get the Jeep. I also have a 1954 Dodge Power Wagon that needs to be put back together, so that’s my dream farm/woods truck, someday!
I write all of this for those interested. Lots to consider! However, a main reason for the thread was to explore a vehicle for getting hardwood stems/logs or firewood rounds out. Yes, I have def considered a 3pt winch. Your mention of onsite processing of firewood has been my idea as the best way. The tract is almost one-half mile long, so, clearing multiple landing/processing spots would help with hauling distance instead of hauling every load back to my normal takeoff spot. I have considered skidding logs but not very long, as I don't want to tear up my trails because they are real nice. Plus, as you mention, the problem of tearing up residual trees is not a good option IMO. I've looked into using a log arch for hauling logs or forestry trailer for hauling shorter logs or rounds. This project would take a LONG time... years. I've spent eight years at it already and 'all' I have really done is build the trails and done a little bit of what I'm talking about. The thought of doing this entire tract is a bit overwhelming, especially, since I am usually alone. Main reasons for doing this is are aesthetics and wildlife benefits. I do not seek a total park-like look but a bit of that. Especially around the trails. I don't need to fell EVERY tree under the dripline (the canopy) of the desired crop trees but if they touch a crop tree's crown, they have to go if you're wanting to release the crop tree. This concept can mean a lot of small saplings in some spots and some competing trees that have some size to them. The latter meaning... firewood. The main crop trees are red oak, white oak and hickory but mostly white oak. Large ones or smaller ones that have perfectly straight stems that would make great mature trees. White oaks have major wildlife benefits plus make great firewood and also lumber if milled. (Blowdowns of huge ones do occur!) One thing I have considered doing FIRST is... carry out this removal of all small saplings and crop tree release around the trails only. For aesthetics and because it's a heckua lot more doable mentally than the entire tract. My main trail meanders around the boundary of the tract. That trail is over a mile long. Take an arbitrary number -- 50 -- so, clear the brush and saplings and competing trees 50 ft (17 steps) each side of the trail. What you'd have is a meandering trail that is 100 ft wide and an open feel to it. All under a heavy forest canopy. If it's one mile long, that is over 12 acres! This idea, alone, is a lot of clearing and hauling. BTW... a reason for clearing out all of the countless saplings (around the trail, at least) is to make at least a lot of the tract accessible to the John Deere Gator, ATV or tractor for getting to trees that die or fall. It's fairly open in a few areas but most of it, you can't just strike out through the woods, it's too thick. As for dead-standing trees, I do leave some dead ones in the forest for wildlife (various critters like dead trees) but if it's a great firewood tree and not punky, I 'harvest' it for firewood. For instance, a lightning strike of a huge red oak. Or white oak blowdowns from ferocious winds.
Do you know how lucky you are to have a wife who will work with you like that? Awesome! That is the ultimate. I have actually wished for same, lol. I considered a Jeep but the bed is too small. Using a trailer will certainly work but it's not nearly as maneuverable on tight trails. But your setup is terrific! That Power Wagon you mentioned is cool! It's also small, barely a longer wheelbase than a Minicab truck.
Nope, trails stay the same, just wide enough for the vehicles. The 100 ft idea is just where brush, saplings, and competing trees would be thinned instead of being concerned with cleaning and thinning the entire tract.
I have a somewhat similar amount of wooded property that you have but I live on the property. When I bought my property I cleaned up all of the tops from when it was logged. I then met with a state forester and they gave me a plan to follow based off of what I wanted to do with the property. Then emerald ash borer hit and threw everything for a loop but I'm still chugging away at cutting grapevines, and thinning out honeysuckle and other undesirables. Was coincidentally in a timber harvesting class last night and they talked about recommended best practice for a timber sale. The number one thing not to do was cut the timber yourself and try to market it. You sell timber by stumpage with the help of a consulting forester. If nobody wants the timber, it's still living vs sitting out in log form somewhere and rotting or turning into high dollar firewood. I've been in other classes and they've said if folks managed their woods better they'd be able to grow 20% more BF of lumber. That definitely sounds like what you are trying to accomplish. I wish I could manage mine better because I'd like to get at least one cutting out of it. You have to grow little trees to make big trees. Just like you have grow little bucks to make big bucks. Aren't you worried about thinning the woods out so much that when you do have it logged that you'll pretty much end up with a clear cut ? You definitely don't want to have your timber high graded either. https://extension.psu.edu/thinking-of-selling-your-timber-beware-of-high-grading Have you thought about talking to a consulting or state forester and having a timber sale of the undesirable trees ? It's a win-win situation IMHO. You get paid for the timber, and you don't have to worry about cutting them down either.
Matter of fact, just an hour ago spoke with my friend who is in the logging business and has a log truck. He is going to look over the tract with me. He thinks his boss or someone will log the tract selectively if I decide to do that, so, it is good to know that it might even be an option. For instance, logging the gums and some other trees out. He added "You may not want to do that based on what you want to do with it." So, he is aware that some loggers leave the residual in a shape that I am not willing to accept and that is without me even discussing hardly any of this with him. I just told him I have a really nice hardwood tract with nice trails. He knows that some people do care a lot about what is left growing and "collateral damage," as he called it. As for a forester, I spoke to one with the state early this week and she is to do the same, look at the tract with me and share ideas of a potential strategy.
